Sunday, August 31, 2014
RBG| Assata Speaks, LIKE IT IS With Gil Noble
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Kim Jones • 17 days ago The issue of police brutality and the over policing in our communities will never be resolved until issues of violence, poverty and hopelessness are resolved. The police do what they want because we are not united and we do not fight back and demand our rights. During harder times than this- the Civil Rights movement, black people spoke with one voice and took heat, threats and the lives of some to get voting and civil rights. Today too many of us are broken and have given up. White supremacy and racism is still an issue and we have to start fighting back. Black men and women need t come together and unite, I see us on the streets of Ferguson but where are the white, asian and latino people that we elevate so much. It is time to grow up and put our agenda for equal rights front and centre and that means getting the President to act. ____________
Kim Jones • 20 days ago There has to come a time when we stop chasing after white acceptance and stand on our own two feet. Self hatred and a lack of self respect is killing the black community. We need to spend time uplifting ourselves and building up our own self worth not depending on white people. _________________
Kim Jones • 2 months ago You need to educate yourself. The poorest most welfare and food stamp dependent states that pay the least tax dollars to the government but need the most federal government assistance are all Republican led states-Mississippi, Louisiana, Tennessee, Alabama, South Carolina. Poor Republican whites are the moochers and takers that your own party leadership talks about. Democrats have tried to push social equality, fair pay, minimum wage, voting and civil rights that help the poor the most. You need to look at the GOP party leadership that does not want to implement Obamacare, expand Medicaid, cut food stamps, stop unemployment benefits-how is that helping poor white people. _____________________
Kim Jones • 2 months ago That should be the only issue for Conservatives. I know the right wing members of the Supreme court hope to help Republicans but this will backfire. Women, progressives and unions will be energized come November for the mid terms which would likely not have happened.
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Kim Jones • 3 months ago I laugh so hard at Republican hypocrisy yet again. Having the nerve to play the "this is all Obamas fault card " for every Bush/Cheney mess is so desperate. We remember that Bush/Cheney/Powell/Rice lied to the American people abut WMDs in Iraq and led us in to a futile, inept. illegal war that should never have happened. Thousands of our troops, thousands of civillians did die for NOTHING. This war should never have started and their has been internal turmoil in Iraq ever since. Bush signed a withdrawal agreement in 08 and Obama tried to get Maliki to agree to some US troops staying which was declined by the Iraqi government.
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Kim Jones • 3 months ago FIRSTLY TEEN PREGNANCIES IN THE BLACK COMMUNITY HAVE BEEN CUT BY 50% IN THE PAST DECADE. SECONDLY GRADUATION RATES FROM SCHOOL AND COLLEGE FOR BLACK GIRLS IS AT ITS HIGHEST LEVELS. PLEASE GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT. WHO RUNS THIS SITE THE KKK-WHAT BLACK SITE WOULD HAVE A STORY FROM THEBLAZE WHICH IS A RACIST WEBSITE RUN BY GLEN BECK. PLEASE STOP SHOWCASING INFO FROM RACISTS.
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Kim Jones • 3 months ago Black voters were diverse until the Republicans decided on a racist Southern strategy. No Black person would support the GOP when it embraces birthers, the Tea party, fox news, Ted Nugent, Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, Glenn Beck and assorted bigots.
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Kim Jones • 4 months ago Bill O'Reilly is a racist scumbag. He is a typical Right wing Fox news hate monger. They cannot bear to see any black person get ahead or be prominent. He can barely hide how much he hates Beyonce. Bill sticks to his ignorance and false facts to hate on Beyonce. Teen pregnancies are down in all communities and down by 51% in black America. Teen girls are graduating from high school in record numbers. Black girls are entering college and graduating in record numbers. It never happens on Fox that they use facts to back up their foolish points.
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Thursday, August 28, 2014
Great Conversations with my Great Friend Sister Courtney :)
Courtney: What a horrifying picture of his father. This should of never happened.
Me: The picture of the father weeping shows the pain of the family of Michael Brown. Michael Brown’s death was a tragedy. Many of the supporters of Darren Wilson are stone cold, non-empathic racists to put it plainly. We are certainly in a war for our survival as a people. Situations like these document the need for us to stand. We have to stand up for our rights and for our humanity if we want to be free. I have no problems with nonviolence or self-defense.
You are 100 percent correct Sister Courtney.
Courtney: As you know, their are many ways to win a war. . And it will take more than just one way. You know, I was watching the Panther movie and one thing stood out that I believe to be true to my core. When Bobby Seals and Huey basically told Cleaver, not to go at the police that night. That was only going to make it worst and they had the right things in motion, to continue to make the gov't and police look like the aggressors, making them change tactics in backing them up, fumbling. etc.They needed every black person to LISTEN.Only using their guns when they were defending on the spot.Huey and Bobby had the gov't changing the laws on the spot. And both men were insightful and intelligent enough to play the game that kept them and their people safer. THEY WERE on their GROWN MANHOOD VIBE AND HAD MORE THAN ONE ANSWER . THEY could not be put in a box. Whatever was thrown at them, they had the intelligence to give them back the right answers with the right actions , in every given situation. Those are the men that I love.Because, it's all predicated in PROTECTING . (which falls in line with different ways of doing that in different situations) Can't have the same answer for every issue.When they changed the law, they would find the loophole and change along with it. :) Brilliant.
They had the answer for what needed to be done, in this America. Once others thought that they had better ideas, without thinking about the entire movement, would be the perfect time to pounce on making the divide even bigger to something that could not be overcomed. Bobby and Huey had black men finding their way in gaining some political power and that was destroyed for many of reasons. Outside influences and those inside who could not understand the bigger picture in America at that time, that would of changed the course of what we see going on today. For some reason, some people could not see how the game was being played.Bobby and Huey were strong. They knew what it would of taken. They had some of the answers.
Me: To be honest, these are some of the greatest words that you have written Sister Courtney. :)
Yes, there are many ways to win a war. We as a community and a people need diverse elements as a means for us to fight injustice. Different situations merit different strategies and you're right to make that point. For example, we need teachers, writers, musicians, scientists, spiritual leaders, political leaders, other warriors, etc. working in one common goal (while expressing gifts in many different ways) to achieve the justice that we all seek. Yes, that scene (from the "Panther" classic movie) that you have described about the Panther film is a very excellent analogy. Bobby Seale and Huey P. Newton disagreed with Cleaver on whether to strike at the police during the aftermath of Dr. King's unjust assassination (Cleaver ironically supported Reagan during the 1980’s. LOL. Reagan was the same man that he cursed out. LOL. My brothers joke about Cleaver, but he was a strong Brother in his own right), because Cleaver in that scene wanted to use preemptive violence against the police during an ill-conceived time (because the police was going to use that as an excuse to murder Bobby Hutton. Bobby Hutton’s death was unjust). In that scene, Huey and Seale was right. Their actions did cause the CA legislature to change laws. They adjusting to changing laws and they have expressed TRUE MANHOOD in the struggle for liberation. Using self-defense is fine. The old school BPP were making progress and that is why Hoover and other forces attacked them. Your point is the same point that Malcolm X have made. I have Malcolm X’s quote in 1965 when he said that he doesn’t want to execute indiscriminate violence against all whites, but he believed in self-defense. Therefore, we have to be rational and reasonable in our strategies and actions. Realness is never about murdering people randomly as you have brilliantly stated. Being real is about embracing the knowledge of self and we can apply wisdom to build up our community. Our communities need development. Yes, Huey and Bobby Seale understood political analysis (they criticized imperialism heavily), economics, and strategies. I don’t feel that a race war will occur in our generation or anytime soon. If it does occur, millions of people could potentially die and it will have very destructive consequences regardless. Evil people always use divide and conquer strategies as a means to cause some black people to fight and hate other when we should hate oppression not people personally.
That is why, especially with the events in Ferguson, that we need more Black Unity and Black solidarity. At the end of the day, we want all of our families to prosper, we want the black community to grow, and for humanity (of every color) to have justice.
Courtney: In my opinion only, I know this is right..Cleaver was strong in his own right and if their was an army that needed to be headed up, he would be someone that would of fit that role. But the intelligence part was Bobby and Huey. Everyone needed to work together. Before you can pick up a gun, you have to know what it is ,that needs to be done first.This is what Cleaver failed to see.And that hurt them. Im not saying that he was not important but, just seeing that showed somethings.Some people need to feel the need to BE, when he should of been silent in that moment and protected those men. That was not the right scenario.They all wanted the same things but ego's had to be left at the door.Bobby and Huey had a full understanding of what they were dealing with. They studied it.They had other people from other countries, paying attention and even supporting them.They were on the right track..They needed men that would comply with them every step of the way. The scene when Huey was shot by the officer and survived, and went to trial, was another significant moment.
That full understanding of their laws and how they played it . The thing is, the points that they implemented, were the seeds for the community to do just as you said.They put in place things that would of allowed the black communities to grow,become responsive and responsible, community oriented, protectors that would of allowed for all the other things to follow .Their would of been less stress because their would of been a sense of pride and dignity restored. They had many of the answers. They had structure and foundation.They were thinking about the whole.A mold that would of been duplicated in other states.They tried their best and because of that, their should be nothing but respect for them and those that understood and followed them.A race war in my opinion would not be in the best interest of african americans here.War is the last resort.This is a war that has to be chipped away at and strategized and it takes much cooperation when you are outnumbered here.(hypothetically speaking) Now, all brown nations etc coming together would be somewhat of a different story but even that takes strategy.The Bpp certainly were not cowards but smart and courageous..Those black women too.In the movie Panther, Bokeem, Kareem and the kid that got shot by the drug dealer, were all right.!! They were the REAL STRENGTH along with Huey and Bobby.It was also amusing to see how during the recruitment scene, how they were looking at the pimp talking about joining and a few others who did not appear to be conscious enough.
Me: Cleaver was a journalist before he joined up with the BPP. His legitimate contributions are things that I agree with. I don’t agree with his errors. Bobby and Huey were definitely intellectuals. Both of them studied philosophy, economics, and political thinking. Black people of diverse gifts should work together. Before anyone can execute policy, people have to know which policies work and which policies don’t work. As for a gun, a gun is a tool. Anyone who owns a gun should be educated on it and trained on its usage as well. Cleaver in that scene wanted to be the top “man,” but sometimes a man can be more humble about things, which represents strong character amid a complication. People globally did aid the BPP. The BPP members believed that there were part of an international struggle against imperialism and colonialism (which heavily existed in Africa and Asia). Their 10 Point Program had legitimate aims that communities can use as template even in our time. They were on the right track, because children were being fed via their breakfast program. Also, they formed free health clinics and other programs to address the needs of the community. The community need real resources and protection as a means for it to sustain itself. A lot of black men, women, and children were inspired by their activism, courage, and strength. We need more people to express their dignity in the world today. We all respect their insights and heroism in standing up against police brutality and economic exploitation. We certainly don’t need a race war to solve our problems. We can use constructive, strong, and positive economic and political actions. We should utilize unique strategies too. The scene of Huey being shot by the officer dealt with the law. Huey's friend invoked the Fifth Amendment, so he wouldn't incriminate himself. That is why learning about the law is so important. We have to understand and defend our human rights. Basically fighting for human rights beyond just civil rights. We are an international people.
The black women in the BPP were courageous and strong as well. We both have done a lot of research on the Strong Sisters in the BPP.
Courtney: And their laid cleavers Strength, The power of words being a journalist. Everyone had their talents and needed to work together, humbling themselves to the fact that their talents ,served to help the whole. In so many ways, he was the top dog in his own right with his talents. Being humbled about that should of followed next.Looking over seeing the talents of Bobby and Huey, and standing next to them in his own right as a journalist was extremely powerful. Why did he not see that at first?He was part of the puzzle and that should of been enough.Coming from a journalist background, is extremely powerful. It is one of the ultimate tools. NOt only that, he had the power to crank out more journalist under him, during the movement. Teaching them the trade etc. YOu said:but sometimes a man being more humble about things represents strong character amidst a complication. Agreed!! Being humble does not make one weak but stronger. It goes back to Huey and Bobby again. The scene that comes to mind is the scene were Bobby tells Huey at the park, that he and the fellas took a vote and that it would be best that Huey stayed behind, instead of going to the California legislation, storming in with their right to bear arms. Huey did not fight that because he knew he was right.
History would of been marked differently and possibly turned out differently during that day, had Huey went and not Bobby. Bobby was the better fit for that situation but Huey understood that his action to stay back and not fight it, was a decision for the whole. It wasn't about HIM!!! but more about how he was the controversial so called figure so they sent Bobby. That's Love.That's being humble. :) Understanding your chess pieces. Not rushing making rash decisions. You said: The BPP members believed that there were part of an international struggle against imperialism and colonialism. Their 10 Point Program had legitimate aims that communities can use as template even in our time. A lot of black men, women, and children were inspired by their activism, courage, and strength. We need more people to express their dignity in the world today. They had it right..
Me: Cleaver was not p.c. when it came to words. LOL. He was blatantly honest. He was gifted in journalism and creating literature. He wrote famous books like Soul on Ice (which was very controversial when it came out during the 1960’s). Cleaver coordinated the BPP in many ways. Each of us has different gifts. When we appreciate our gifts and express it in a positive way, then we can further appreciate other human being’s talents too. There should no ego tripping involved when we are dealing with the liberation of our people. Each situation in life will be different. Sometimes, it is necessary to be aggressive and during other times, it is time to be more humble. Bobby and Huey certainly respected Cleaver’s journalist talents. Being humble does cause a man or a woman to have contemplation about life. Being humble allows a person to reflect more about life and it does build strength. Humbleness increases social strength, because wise evaluation of things mixed with discernment is of benefit for humanity. The scene of the park was important. Huey stayed behind, because he knew that if he was there in Sacramento, then both of him and Bobby could have been arrested. They used strategy in that instance. Also, Huey and Bobby had similarities and differences. They knew each other’s personalities and Bobby was the man who spoke his mind in the California legislation (in talking about the need of the right to bear arms and to refute the notion that the BPP was racist. The BPP members were never racist). Bobby Seale led a protest against the then Mulford bill.
The movement for social change is never about selfish individualism. It is about love and it is about advancing the interests of the community. There is nothing wrong with wise decision making. You are showing great jewels of wisdom today Sister like usual. :)
Me: Goodnight Sister Courtney. I want to show you this quote from Malcolm X. He said these words in January 19, 1965:
"... I believe that any area of the United States, where the federal government has shown either its unwillingness or inability to protect the lives and the property of the black American, then it is time for the black Americans to band together and do whatever is necessary to see that we get the type of protection we need...I mean just that. Whatever is necessary. This does not mean that we should go out and initiate acts of aggression indiscriminately in the white community. But it does mean that, if we are going to be respected as human beings, we should reserve the right to defend ourselves by whatever means necessary. This is recognized and accepted in any civilized society....We're not a cadre, nor do we want it to be felt that we want to be tough. We're trying to be HUMAN beings, and we want to be recognized and accepted as HUMAN beings. But we don't think humanity will recognize us or accept us as such until humanity knows that we will do everything to protect our human ranks, as others will do for theirs."
You're a Great Friend and I appreciate a great deal this conversation (on an important issue).
Sister, I have your back forever. NY and VA will always be in the house. :) God Bless You.
TTYL.
Courtney: That's it. Intelligence. Malcolm was not wrong.Any human being, any man would do the same and they have throughout history. The black and brown man would be no different. So many of his speeches were right and he never excluded the BLACK WOMAN at all either. He understood the black woman's importance .Thank you for the quote. You have shown lots of jewels too.
Me: P.S. You're Welcome Sister Courtney.
By Timothy
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Me: These images are important.
Courtney: Yes they are. Heartbreaking but at the same time ,hopeful. Their was an image during the protest last week, that I saw on the news. I have not seen it since. It was a photo of a young african american man and woman and he was holding her as she was looking out towards the street. Those images are so important and hopefully someone can find that picture to ask them, what was going through their minds at that moment.It looked as if he was protecting her. I love that photo.
Me: Yes, the family of Michael Brown are going through unspeakable pain. We should have hope. At the end of the day, unwarranted hatred is not the answer, but revolutionary change in the world can help the world. The photo that you have described is really powerful. It shows what it is all about. We are one people. There is no shame in a black man protecting a Sister. I'm glad that you loved that photo. The events in Ferguson are a turning point in our history. Hopefully, things can change in a positive direction for the future.
Courtney: Hatred is never the answer.It's the definition of a racist. On another note, when you said you watched Panther yesterday, I went and rewatched it. ONe thing that stood out was when Huey said the the two white college students that asked, " how do we become a panther"? and Huey said that they couldnt but that they could start their own and fight the injustices as well.
And then he went on to say, Power to the people meant, all people. Power to black people,. Power to white people, power to whoever. I think he was saying , this racist stuff is a tool and that their was something else that was bigger than all of this that required everyones attention.
Again, the film is really underrated. As you also stated, those images of Ferguson, of people supporting one another, cleaning up, protecting the stores are so important
Me: Indeed.
Hatred only brings more instability in life. What we have found in the world is that Love is stronger than hatred. True love can build movements, inspire change, and cause people to fight harder against injustice. The racist is wrong, because there is no liberation in degrading a person by virtue of their skin color or their ethnicity. There is no virtue in falsely demonizing a person inappropriately. I know the scene that you have described. Huey realized that black liberation is tied to human liberation regardless of what troublemakers say. We know who the troublemakers are. LOL. Regardless of their lies, we know the truth. The truth is that black people are entitled to justice, freedom, and equality. The truth is that the Golden Rule of treating our neighbor as ourselves is a legitimate ideal to embrace. Power to the people precisely mean power to all of the people of the human race. Readily, the one percent would exploit the human race in order to cause injustice while they seek more power and more oligarchy. The Panther film is really underrated. My favorite part of the film is when the Black Panthers came into the California legislature armed with rifles. Bobby Seale said that he is anti-oppression and you can't fight hate with racism. That is the point that you have made. :)
The people of Ferguson have done charities and food drives to help the community as well.
Courtney: Absolutely. Nothing is more powerful than LOVE, WHY DO you think so many in the world, truly FEAR it? LOVE makes you accountable PERIOD. And it seems, so many don't want to be accountable for anything. It is always easier to do the opposite of love because in a nut shell, it's easier.
You said: My favorite part of the film is when the Black Panther came into the California legislature armed with rifles. Bobby Seale said that he is anti-oppression and you can't fight hate with racist.
I remember when I was first told that growing up. To actually see that image of black men doing just that, showed the level of strength, warrior mentality intertwined with intelligence that those men had for not only themselves, but for their community, their women and children. They were not about murdering and killing unnecessarily. They were about peaceful fairness but also about defending themselves and their community, when agitators came in to police,harass, beat and even murder its citizens.
Me: Me personally, I am at a point in my life, that if a Brother or a Sister is a communist or not, if that person wants liberation sincerely, then that person should not be thrown into jail at all. Claudia Jones was a Communist and she was a Sister who fought for the liberation of black people sincerely. I am not a Communist, but I'm not a reactionary either. The Sister fought discrimination, racism, and economic injustices in the UK. Yes, the government lied about the Black Panthers. Black people were denied fundamental freedoms. We are still denied true freedom today. Also, they did want equal treatment, fair housing, good jobs, etc.
Courtney: Most people are not communist. I am not. I remember they even tried to say that lucille Ball was a communist. lol .I don't remember it but I did read that. Like really, Everyone is a communist? All of the issues in the movie, actually happened.They actually purposely, flooded those communities with drugs.Set people up etc.And they didn't do anything. Fighting for what is fair, should not be labeled. Its a God given right for all men to be free and treated fairly..
Me: It is the Cold War and the McCarthyite era of the 1950's that agitated anti-Communist paranoia in a higher level. Everyone is not a communist. LOL. Extremists view a lot of people as Communist for even standing up for racial justice. The feds did flood communities with drugs via the Golden Triangle, etc. They caused divisions and they illegally monitored the BPP. The Black Panthers were scapegoated for the events of the 1960's. The truth is that people wanted to be free. After WWII, nations in the Motherland fought for their independence. People just wanted to have a chance of true liberation from oppression. Some folks get too caught up into labels. We have the God given right to freedom, to be treated fair, and to have justice.
Me: P.S. Here is one quote from a great Black Panther:
"...You don't fight racism with racism, the best way to fight racism is with solidarity..."
-Bobby Seale
Yes, the Black Panthers were about defending their families and their communities. The warrior mentality of black men is great. Black men and Black women working together, loving each other, and standing up for freedom is what it is all about.
Courtney: Amazing quote.They were never in the beginning what the govt tried to make them to be. They were not communist etc. They just wanted to be left alone.
They wanted equal treatment, fair housing, good jobs, etc..Black people were being denied that. The part were Bobby said to Huey, that we took a vote and we think its best you stay behind, That you are too risky, was a great scene.
Thats the scene that sets up the panthers going to the California Legislature about them trying to change the law because black people were starting to understand the constitution and the right to bear arms. :) Huey agreed that he should stay behind. lol
Me: Again, Goodnight Sister Courtney. :)
It has a been a great discussion with you.
You're a Real Sister like always. Bless You.
Peace and Blessings to You.
TTYL
Courtney: Thank you. Have a good night. Blessings.
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Me: On another note, Have you listened to the music from the Three Degrees yet? If so, what do you think of their music?
I know that you are gifted in music Sister.
Courtney: yes. when will I see you again was a huge hit for them back in the day. They reminded me of Donna Summer disco era with that one. The group Emotions come to mind too.Martha and the Vandelles etc The three girl group like the Supremes.
I mean, these are their authentic , angelic voices. No manipulation to their voices. REAL singing.So many back then. Donna Summers had that kind of voice. Diana Ross too. I know alot of people think Diana didn't have a strong voice but she did.Whitney Houston comes to mind as well with the same kind of similarities although whitney had a longer range.My opinion.The Arethas , Patti's Glady's etc are different caliber of singers.Some of their voices are stronger in a different sense. Loved them too. :)
This is how Diva Devotee summed up her voice Dianas Voice.
Vocal Type: Light lyric soprano
Vocal Range: 3 Octaves C3-C#6
Whistle Register:No
Vocal Pluses: Smoky lower range, which is dark and heavy. Her midrange is lighter, softer and has a warm timbre that carries through the to the top of the range. There is an intrinsic sweetness and youthfulness to the voice that is accentuated by her excellent phrasing. The chest voice is clear and light, effortlessly extending up to an A5 with the help of her excellent technique and clever mixing of the chest and head voice. The head voice is bright and robust, with great dynamics.
Vocal Negatives: The voice's lightness is often interpreted as it lacking power as whole, with the term "weak" sometimes being applied to the voice's tone.
As you know, I think Diana's These Are A Few Of My Favorite Things, is vocally perfect.pronunciation, pitch,emotion. Would of loved to of been in the studio to watch those vocals cut. She probably sang it straight through. :) Then you go to a song like SOME DAY, WE'LL BE TOGETHER AND she drops her vocals . YES!!! You hear her emotions in this song, its a bit darker but stronger.No other person will ever sing that song better than her in my opinion.She is a Legend and I will always have the utmost respect for her voice.
Me: Cool :)
I know that you respect Diana Ross. She has talent, glamour, and creativity. Diana Ross has a sweet voice with style. All of the other singers have their unique stories, but they are unified in expressing to the world the gift of music and love of true expression. We can talk about the musicians that you have listed for hours. I also like Odetta's voice. She had a strong, soulful voice too. Marlena Shaw is an underated singer as well. Her song California Soul is one anthem of the 1960's era.
What more can you say about Donna Summer. Even back in the late 1960's, she created great music. She performed great music and her music just cheers people up. Her music makes people feel good.
The group does remind me of the Emotions and Donna Summer. TVOne's Unsung has shown an episode about the Emotions recently. It was a great episode. The Supremes had classic records too like You Keep Hangin On and Soul Love. Yes, Diana Ross's voice on the song "My Favorite Things" is exquisite, powerful, and precise.
Courtney: That's the thing, So many girl groups that were born out of motown and aftewards, had great vocalist. You know this can go on and on so im going to save this for a different thread. lol But yes, the Three degrees along with the rest were so extremely talented and we should never forget any of them and what they gave to the world of music.
Me: We should always remember their talent and so many other musicians (many of whom are unsung). On the Ferguson issue, a lot of information is coming out. You know how I like to learn information. We all are inspired to stand up and to advocate real solutions.
Courtney: Agreed. Yes their is more information coming out for sure.
Me: I am about to leave for a few hours. Have a Blessed Day Sister Courtney. It has been a great conversation with you. You are one of the greatest human beings that I know in my life. Keep up the Great Work like I know you will. Bless You :)
Courtney: Check you later . :)
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Me: The picture of the father weeping shows the pain of the family of Michael Brown. Michael Brown’s death was a tragedy. Many of the supporters of Darren Wilson are stone cold, non-empathic racists to put it plainly. We are certainly in a war for our survival as a people. Situations like these document the need for us to stand. We have to stand up for our rights and for our humanity if we want to be free. I have no problems with nonviolence or self-defense.
You are 100 percent correct Sister Courtney.
Courtney: As you know, their are many ways to win a war. . And it will take more than just one way. You know, I was watching the Panther movie and one thing stood out that I believe to be true to my core. When Bobby Seals and Huey basically told Cleaver, not to go at the police that night. That was only going to make it worst and they had the right things in motion, to continue to make the gov't and police look like the aggressors, making them change tactics in backing them up, fumbling. etc.They needed every black person to LISTEN.Only using their guns when they were defending on the spot.Huey and Bobby had the gov't changing the laws on the spot. And both men were insightful and intelligent enough to play the game that kept them and their people safer. THEY WERE on their GROWN MANHOOD VIBE AND HAD MORE THAN ONE ANSWER . THEY could not be put in a box. Whatever was thrown at them, they had the intelligence to give them back the right answers with the right actions , in every given situation. Those are the men that I love.Because, it's all predicated in PROTECTING . (which falls in line with different ways of doing that in different situations) Can't have the same answer for every issue.When they changed the law, they would find the loophole and change along with it. :) Brilliant.
They had the answer for what needed to be done, in this America. Once others thought that they had better ideas, without thinking about the entire movement, would be the perfect time to pounce on making the divide even bigger to something that could not be overcomed. Bobby and Huey had black men finding their way in gaining some political power and that was destroyed for many of reasons. Outside influences and those inside who could not understand the bigger picture in America at that time, that would of changed the course of what we see going on today. For some reason, some people could not see how the game was being played.Bobby and Huey were strong. They knew what it would of taken. They had some of the answers.
Me: To be honest, these are some of the greatest words that you have written Sister Courtney. :)
Yes, there are many ways to win a war. We as a community and a people need diverse elements as a means for us to fight injustice. Different situations merit different strategies and you're right to make that point. For example, we need teachers, writers, musicians, scientists, spiritual leaders, political leaders, other warriors, etc. working in one common goal (while expressing gifts in many different ways) to achieve the justice that we all seek. Yes, that scene (from the "Panther" classic movie) that you have described about the Panther film is a very excellent analogy. Bobby Seale and Huey P. Newton disagreed with Cleaver on whether to strike at the police during the aftermath of Dr. King's unjust assassination (Cleaver ironically supported Reagan during the 1980’s. LOL. Reagan was the same man that he cursed out. LOL. My brothers joke about Cleaver, but he was a strong Brother in his own right), because Cleaver in that scene wanted to use preemptive violence against the police during an ill-conceived time (because the police was going to use that as an excuse to murder Bobby Hutton. Bobby Hutton’s death was unjust). In that scene, Huey and Seale was right. Their actions did cause the CA legislature to change laws. They adjusting to changing laws and they have expressed TRUE MANHOOD in the struggle for liberation. Using self-defense is fine. The old school BPP were making progress and that is why Hoover and other forces attacked them. Your point is the same point that Malcolm X have made. I have Malcolm X’s quote in 1965 when he said that he doesn’t want to execute indiscriminate violence against all whites, but he believed in self-defense. Therefore, we have to be rational and reasonable in our strategies and actions. Realness is never about murdering people randomly as you have brilliantly stated. Being real is about embracing the knowledge of self and we can apply wisdom to build up our community. Our communities need development. Yes, Huey and Bobby Seale understood political analysis (they criticized imperialism heavily), economics, and strategies. I don’t feel that a race war will occur in our generation or anytime soon. If it does occur, millions of people could potentially die and it will have very destructive consequences regardless. Evil people always use divide and conquer strategies as a means to cause some black people to fight and hate other when we should hate oppression not people personally.
That is why, especially with the events in Ferguson, that we need more Black Unity and Black solidarity. At the end of the day, we want all of our families to prosper, we want the black community to grow, and for humanity (of every color) to have justice.
Courtney: In my opinion only, I know this is right..Cleaver was strong in his own right and if their was an army that needed to be headed up, he would be someone that would of fit that role. But the intelligence part was Bobby and Huey. Everyone needed to work together. Before you can pick up a gun, you have to know what it is ,that needs to be done first.This is what Cleaver failed to see.And that hurt them. Im not saying that he was not important but, just seeing that showed somethings.Some people need to feel the need to BE, when he should of been silent in that moment and protected those men. That was not the right scenario.They all wanted the same things but ego's had to be left at the door.Bobby and Huey had a full understanding of what they were dealing with. They studied it.They had other people from other countries, paying attention and even supporting them.They were on the right track..They needed men that would comply with them every step of the way. The scene when Huey was shot by the officer and survived, and went to trial, was another significant moment.
That full understanding of their laws and how they played it . The thing is, the points that they implemented, were the seeds for the community to do just as you said.They put in place things that would of allowed the black communities to grow,become responsive and responsible, community oriented, protectors that would of allowed for all the other things to follow .Their would of been less stress because their would of been a sense of pride and dignity restored. They had many of the answers. They had structure and foundation.They were thinking about the whole.A mold that would of been duplicated in other states.They tried their best and because of that, their should be nothing but respect for them and those that understood and followed them.A race war in my opinion would not be in the best interest of african americans here.War is the last resort.This is a war that has to be chipped away at and strategized and it takes much cooperation when you are outnumbered here.(hypothetically speaking) Now, all brown nations etc coming together would be somewhat of a different story but even that takes strategy.The Bpp certainly were not cowards but smart and courageous..Those black women too.In the movie Panther, Bokeem, Kareem and the kid that got shot by the drug dealer, were all right.!! They were the REAL STRENGTH along with Huey and Bobby.It was also amusing to see how during the recruitment scene, how they were looking at the pimp talking about joining and a few others who did not appear to be conscious enough.
Me: Cleaver was a journalist before he joined up with the BPP. His legitimate contributions are things that I agree with. I don’t agree with his errors. Bobby and Huey were definitely intellectuals. Both of them studied philosophy, economics, and political thinking. Black people of diverse gifts should work together. Before anyone can execute policy, people have to know which policies work and which policies don’t work. As for a gun, a gun is a tool. Anyone who owns a gun should be educated on it and trained on its usage as well. Cleaver in that scene wanted to be the top “man,” but sometimes a man can be more humble about things, which represents strong character amid a complication. People globally did aid the BPP. The BPP members believed that there were part of an international struggle against imperialism and colonialism (which heavily existed in Africa and Asia). Their 10 Point Program had legitimate aims that communities can use as template even in our time. They were on the right track, because children were being fed via their breakfast program. Also, they formed free health clinics and other programs to address the needs of the community. The community need real resources and protection as a means for it to sustain itself. A lot of black men, women, and children were inspired by their activism, courage, and strength. We need more people to express their dignity in the world today. We all respect their insights and heroism in standing up against police brutality and economic exploitation. We certainly don’t need a race war to solve our problems. We can use constructive, strong, and positive economic and political actions. We should utilize unique strategies too. The scene of Huey being shot by the officer dealt with the law. Huey's friend invoked the Fifth Amendment, so he wouldn't incriminate himself. That is why learning about the law is so important. We have to understand and defend our human rights. Basically fighting for human rights beyond just civil rights. We are an international people.
The black women in the BPP were courageous and strong as well. We both have done a lot of research on the Strong Sisters in the BPP.
Courtney: And their laid cleavers Strength, The power of words being a journalist. Everyone had their talents and needed to work together, humbling themselves to the fact that their talents ,served to help the whole. In so many ways, he was the top dog in his own right with his talents. Being humbled about that should of followed next.Looking over seeing the talents of Bobby and Huey, and standing next to them in his own right as a journalist was extremely powerful. Why did he not see that at first?He was part of the puzzle and that should of been enough.Coming from a journalist background, is extremely powerful. It is one of the ultimate tools. NOt only that, he had the power to crank out more journalist under him, during the movement. Teaching them the trade etc. YOu said:but sometimes a man being more humble about things represents strong character amidst a complication. Agreed!! Being humble does not make one weak but stronger. It goes back to Huey and Bobby again. The scene that comes to mind is the scene were Bobby tells Huey at the park, that he and the fellas took a vote and that it would be best that Huey stayed behind, instead of going to the California legislation, storming in with their right to bear arms. Huey did not fight that because he knew he was right.
History would of been marked differently and possibly turned out differently during that day, had Huey went and not Bobby. Bobby was the better fit for that situation but Huey understood that his action to stay back and not fight it, was a decision for the whole. It wasn't about HIM!!! but more about how he was the controversial so called figure so they sent Bobby. That's Love.That's being humble. :) Understanding your chess pieces. Not rushing making rash decisions. You said: The BPP members believed that there were part of an international struggle against imperialism and colonialism. Their 10 Point Program had legitimate aims that communities can use as template even in our time. A lot of black men, women, and children were inspired by their activism, courage, and strength. We need more people to express their dignity in the world today. They had it right..
Me: Cleaver was not p.c. when it came to words. LOL. He was blatantly honest. He was gifted in journalism and creating literature. He wrote famous books like Soul on Ice (which was very controversial when it came out during the 1960’s). Cleaver coordinated the BPP in many ways. Each of us has different gifts. When we appreciate our gifts and express it in a positive way, then we can further appreciate other human being’s talents too. There should no ego tripping involved when we are dealing with the liberation of our people. Each situation in life will be different. Sometimes, it is necessary to be aggressive and during other times, it is time to be more humble. Bobby and Huey certainly respected Cleaver’s journalist talents. Being humble does cause a man or a woman to have contemplation about life. Being humble allows a person to reflect more about life and it does build strength. Humbleness increases social strength, because wise evaluation of things mixed with discernment is of benefit for humanity. The scene of the park was important. Huey stayed behind, because he knew that if he was there in Sacramento, then both of him and Bobby could have been arrested. They used strategy in that instance. Also, Huey and Bobby had similarities and differences. They knew each other’s personalities and Bobby was the man who spoke his mind in the California legislation (in talking about the need of the right to bear arms and to refute the notion that the BPP was racist. The BPP members were never racist). Bobby Seale led a protest against the then Mulford bill.
The movement for social change is never about selfish individualism. It is about love and it is about advancing the interests of the community. There is nothing wrong with wise decision making. You are showing great jewels of wisdom today Sister like usual. :)
Me: Goodnight Sister Courtney. I want to show you this quote from Malcolm X. He said these words in January 19, 1965:
"... I believe that any area of the United States, where the federal government has shown either its unwillingness or inability to protect the lives and the property of the black American, then it is time for the black Americans to band together and do whatever is necessary to see that we get the type of protection we need...I mean just that. Whatever is necessary. This does not mean that we should go out and initiate acts of aggression indiscriminately in the white community. But it does mean that, if we are going to be respected as human beings, we should reserve the right to defend ourselves by whatever means necessary. This is recognized and accepted in any civilized society....We're not a cadre, nor do we want it to be felt that we want to be tough. We're trying to be HUMAN beings, and we want to be recognized and accepted as HUMAN beings. But we don't think humanity will recognize us or accept us as such until humanity knows that we will do everything to protect our human ranks, as others will do for theirs."
You're a Great Friend and I appreciate a great deal this conversation (on an important issue).
Sister, I have your back forever. NY and VA will always be in the house. :) God Bless You.
TTYL.
Courtney: That's it. Intelligence. Malcolm was not wrong.Any human being, any man would do the same and they have throughout history. The black and brown man would be no different. So many of his speeches were right and he never excluded the BLACK WOMAN at all either. He understood the black woman's importance .Thank you for the quote. You have shown lots of jewels too.
Me: P.S. You're Welcome Sister Courtney.
By Timothy
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Me: These images are important.
Courtney: Yes they are. Heartbreaking but at the same time ,hopeful. Their was an image during the protest last week, that I saw on the news. I have not seen it since. It was a photo of a young african american man and woman and he was holding her as she was looking out towards the street. Those images are so important and hopefully someone can find that picture to ask them, what was going through their minds at that moment.It looked as if he was protecting her. I love that photo.
Me: Yes, the family of Michael Brown are going through unspeakable pain. We should have hope. At the end of the day, unwarranted hatred is not the answer, but revolutionary change in the world can help the world. The photo that you have described is really powerful. It shows what it is all about. We are one people. There is no shame in a black man protecting a Sister. I'm glad that you loved that photo. The events in Ferguson are a turning point in our history. Hopefully, things can change in a positive direction for the future.
Courtney: Hatred is never the answer.It's the definition of a racist. On another note, when you said you watched Panther yesterday, I went and rewatched it. ONe thing that stood out was when Huey said the the two white college students that asked, " how do we become a panther"? and Huey said that they couldnt but that they could start their own and fight the injustices as well.
And then he went on to say, Power to the people meant, all people. Power to black people,. Power to white people, power to whoever. I think he was saying , this racist stuff is a tool and that their was something else that was bigger than all of this that required everyones attention.
Again, the film is really underrated. As you also stated, those images of Ferguson, of people supporting one another, cleaning up, protecting the stores are so important
Me: Indeed.
Hatred only brings more instability in life. What we have found in the world is that Love is stronger than hatred. True love can build movements, inspire change, and cause people to fight harder against injustice. The racist is wrong, because there is no liberation in degrading a person by virtue of their skin color or their ethnicity. There is no virtue in falsely demonizing a person inappropriately. I know the scene that you have described. Huey realized that black liberation is tied to human liberation regardless of what troublemakers say. We know who the troublemakers are. LOL. Regardless of their lies, we know the truth. The truth is that black people are entitled to justice, freedom, and equality. The truth is that the Golden Rule of treating our neighbor as ourselves is a legitimate ideal to embrace. Power to the people precisely mean power to all of the people of the human race. Readily, the one percent would exploit the human race in order to cause injustice while they seek more power and more oligarchy. The Panther film is really underrated. My favorite part of the film is when the Black Panthers came into the California legislature armed with rifles. Bobby Seale said that he is anti-oppression and you can't fight hate with racism. That is the point that you have made. :)
The people of Ferguson have done charities and food drives to help the community as well.
Courtney: Absolutely. Nothing is more powerful than LOVE, WHY DO you think so many in the world, truly FEAR it? LOVE makes you accountable PERIOD. And it seems, so many don't want to be accountable for anything. It is always easier to do the opposite of love because in a nut shell, it's easier.
You said: My favorite part of the film is when the Black Panther came into the California legislature armed with rifles. Bobby Seale said that he is anti-oppression and you can't fight hate with racist.
I remember when I was first told that growing up. To actually see that image of black men doing just that, showed the level of strength, warrior mentality intertwined with intelligence that those men had for not only themselves, but for their community, their women and children. They were not about murdering and killing unnecessarily. They were about peaceful fairness but also about defending themselves and their community, when agitators came in to police,harass, beat and even murder its citizens.
Me: Me personally, I am at a point in my life, that if a Brother or a Sister is a communist or not, if that person wants liberation sincerely, then that person should not be thrown into jail at all. Claudia Jones was a Communist and she was a Sister who fought for the liberation of black people sincerely. I am not a Communist, but I'm not a reactionary either. The Sister fought discrimination, racism, and economic injustices in the UK. Yes, the government lied about the Black Panthers. Black people were denied fundamental freedoms. We are still denied true freedom today. Also, they did want equal treatment, fair housing, good jobs, etc.
Courtney: Most people are not communist. I am not. I remember they even tried to say that lucille Ball was a communist. lol .I don't remember it but I did read that. Like really, Everyone is a communist? All of the issues in the movie, actually happened.They actually purposely, flooded those communities with drugs.Set people up etc.And they didn't do anything. Fighting for what is fair, should not be labeled. Its a God given right for all men to be free and treated fairly..
Me: It is the Cold War and the McCarthyite era of the 1950's that agitated anti-Communist paranoia in a higher level. Everyone is not a communist. LOL. Extremists view a lot of people as Communist for even standing up for racial justice. The feds did flood communities with drugs via the Golden Triangle, etc. They caused divisions and they illegally monitored the BPP. The Black Panthers were scapegoated for the events of the 1960's. The truth is that people wanted to be free. After WWII, nations in the Motherland fought for their independence. People just wanted to have a chance of true liberation from oppression. Some folks get too caught up into labels. We have the God given right to freedom, to be treated fair, and to have justice.
Me: P.S. Here is one quote from a great Black Panther:
"...You don't fight racism with racism, the best way to fight racism is with solidarity..."
-Bobby Seale
Yes, the Black Panthers were about defending their families and their communities. The warrior mentality of black men is great. Black men and Black women working together, loving each other, and standing up for freedom is what it is all about.
Courtney: Amazing quote.They were never in the beginning what the govt tried to make them to be. They were not communist etc. They just wanted to be left alone.
They wanted equal treatment, fair housing, good jobs, etc..Black people were being denied that. The part were Bobby said to Huey, that we took a vote and we think its best you stay behind, That you are too risky, was a great scene.
Thats the scene that sets up the panthers going to the California Legislature about them trying to change the law because black people were starting to understand the constitution and the right to bear arms. :) Huey agreed that he should stay behind. lol
Me: Again, Goodnight Sister Courtney. :)
It has a been a great discussion with you.
You're a Real Sister like always. Bless You.
Peace and Blessings to You.
TTYL
Courtney: Thank you. Have a good night. Blessings.
__________________
Me: On another note, Have you listened to the music from the Three Degrees yet? If so, what do you think of their music?
I know that you are gifted in music Sister.
Courtney: yes. when will I see you again was a huge hit for them back in the day. They reminded me of Donna Summer disco era with that one. The group Emotions come to mind too.Martha and the Vandelles etc The three girl group like the Supremes.
I mean, these are their authentic , angelic voices. No manipulation to their voices. REAL singing.So many back then. Donna Summers had that kind of voice. Diana Ross too. I know alot of people think Diana didn't have a strong voice but she did.Whitney Houston comes to mind as well with the same kind of similarities although whitney had a longer range.My opinion.The Arethas , Patti's Glady's etc are different caliber of singers.Some of their voices are stronger in a different sense. Loved them too. :)
This is how Diva Devotee summed up her voice Dianas Voice.
Vocal Type: Light lyric soprano
Vocal Range: 3 Octaves C3-C#6
Whistle Register:No
Vocal Pluses: Smoky lower range, which is dark and heavy. Her midrange is lighter, softer and has a warm timbre that carries through the to the top of the range. There is an intrinsic sweetness and youthfulness to the voice that is accentuated by her excellent phrasing. The chest voice is clear and light, effortlessly extending up to an A5 with the help of her excellent technique and clever mixing of the chest and head voice. The head voice is bright and robust, with great dynamics.
Vocal Negatives: The voice's lightness is often interpreted as it lacking power as whole, with the term "weak" sometimes being applied to the voice's tone.
As you know, I think Diana's These Are A Few Of My Favorite Things, is vocally perfect.pronunciation, pitch,emotion. Would of loved to of been in the studio to watch those vocals cut. She probably sang it straight through. :) Then you go to a song like SOME DAY, WE'LL BE TOGETHER AND she drops her vocals . YES!!! You hear her emotions in this song, its a bit darker but stronger.No other person will ever sing that song better than her in my opinion.She is a Legend and I will always have the utmost respect for her voice.
Me: Cool :)
I know that you respect Diana Ross. She has talent, glamour, and creativity. Diana Ross has a sweet voice with style. All of the other singers have their unique stories, but they are unified in expressing to the world the gift of music and love of true expression. We can talk about the musicians that you have listed for hours. I also like Odetta's voice. She had a strong, soulful voice too. Marlena Shaw is an underated singer as well. Her song California Soul is one anthem of the 1960's era.
What more can you say about Donna Summer. Even back in the late 1960's, she created great music. She performed great music and her music just cheers people up. Her music makes people feel good.
The group does remind me of the Emotions and Donna Summer. TVOne's Unsung has shown an episode about the Emotions recently. It was a great episode. The Supremes had classic records too like You Keep Hangin On and Soul Love. Yes, Diana Ross's voice on the song "My Favorite Things" is exquisite, powerful, and precise.
Courtney: That's the thing, So many girl groups that were born out of motown and aftewards, had great vocalist. You know this can go on and on so im going to save this for a different thread. lol But yes, the Three degrees along with the rest were so extremely talented and we should never forget any of them and what they gave to the world of music.
Me: We should always remember their talent and so many other musicians (many of whom are unsung). On the Ferguson issue, a lot of information is coming out. You know how I like to learn information. We all are inspired to stand up and to advocate real solutions.
Courtney: Agreed. Yes their is more information coming out for sure.
Me: I am about to leave for a few hours. Have a Blessed Day Sister Courtney. It has been a great conversation with you. You are one of the greatest human beings that I know in my life. Keep up the Great Work like I know you will. Bless You :)
Courtney: Check you later . :)
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Sunday, August 3, 2014
Great Music and Speeches
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Various Social Commentaries from Savant: Interestingly enough, King was born the year of the crash which precipitated the Great Depression. So, he spent his early childhood years under the shadow of the economic blight. Though he lived in relative comfort, he remembered the breadlines. And he reflects that "I can see the effects of this early childhood experience on my ANTICAPITALIST FEELINGS."(AU TOBIOGRAPHY,p 2., my italics). I do wonder if he isn't reading his later sentiments into his childhood past. Or maybe that was the beginning of what would evoled into Kingian Christian socialism.
-Savant
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There are Marxists who do not say "I am a Marxist", but whose Marxism is evident to anyone who reads them and is reasonably familiar with Marxian ways of thinking.Thus far, I've yet to come across any statement by Lukacs or Gramsci which says "I am a Marxist." Indeed, to avoid Fascist censorship Gramsci was very careful NOT to mention Marxism, and often simply spoke of "philosophy of praxis". But only someone utterly unfamiliar with Marxist thought could be taken in by the disguise. Dr. King, in private writings, interviews, letters often makes clear that he is socialistic in his thinking. What's interesting is in private discourse he often uses the word socialism for what in more public addresses he simply calls "more fully developed democracy." It is common knowledge that socialists of the 19th and 20th centuries often made the critique that "democracy " in capitalist societies wasn't genuine, or was very narrow. It didn't extend to economic life at all, and was often limited even politically for those social classes beneath the bourgeoisie. What these socialists--Marxis t and non-Marxist--held was that a fuller democracy, a more fully actualized democracy is possible and must be created; and this more fully developed democracy meant socialism. (Before the rise of totalitarian states calling themselves socialist, most socialists---and even their adversaries---assu med as a matter of course that socialism meant far more democracy (TOO MUCH for the right and liberals) than is possible under present capitalist conditions in England, France or the USA. King whose focus in philosophical study was (aside from Personalism) mainly SOCIAL PHILOSOPHY knew this. In fact, he opposes fully developed democracy in STRIDE TOWARD FREEDOM and WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE to both Communism and capitalism. To be honest, and put my cards on the table, so do I. Only I am prepared to say PUBLICLY what King usually said privately, that we need a SOCIALIST democracy. That ordinary people need both political freedom and democracy governance of economy and their conditions of work, etc. King had to operate under the blight of McCarthyism. I don't.
-Savant
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Unfortunately, there is mutual animosity between SOME Africans and SOME African Americans. That's obvious even in this thread. And the roots of this is IMPERIALISM, the racist and capitalistic imperialism of the west which has estranged Black people from themselves and each other. Black people here and elsewhere are often caught in a trick, fighting each other along the lines of division created by the common oppressor--each group of Blacks claiming the other is solely responsible, and neither seeing the ultimate roots of the trouble. I can only imagine that the Western imperialists and capitalist pirates and predators are laughing all the way to the bank. Black vs Black hatreds are politically convenient and sometimes downright PROFITABLE to the powers that be. Now if the vast majority Africans thought more like Cabral and Nkrumah? What if most African Americans thought more like Malcolm X, the Panthers or even Gil Scott with his song "Johannesburg "? The racists and exploiters would not be laughing all the way to the bank. And it that sort of revolutionary consciousness that I'm thinking of were to become rampant even within one thread in AA Forum I would not be surprised if the thread--maybe even the entire forum--were shut down. For this would indicate a remarkable awakening and a dangerous new solidarity. I wonder how many Black Americans or Africans have even seriously reflected on that possibility.
-Savant
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By the way, I have no illusions about uniting ALL Africans and ALL Black Americans in North America. In fact, I've no illusions about uniting all Black Americans with each other in North America, or uniting all Africans in Africa itself. Only a doufus thinks he can unite everyone. But you may be able to unite a critical mass strong enough to move forward and transform society. That is certainly worth the effort.
-Savant
________________
In STRIDE TOWARD FREEDOM, STRENGHT TO LOVE & (to a lesser extent) WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE, King objects philosophically to Marxist materialism from the perspective of his own Personalist and Hegelian idealism. So, part of the dispute is philosophical and metaphysical. But he objects MORALLY to the political repression of Marxist-Leninist regimes, regimes which carry out their struggle for a "classless " society in ways which simply reinstitute class oppression in a different form. In STRENGHT TO LOVE King admits that he finds moving the moral passion of Marx and Engels for social justice, and surmises that (atheistic or not) Marx's moral passion derives from the prophetic tradition of his Hebrew heritage. And while King rejects the violence carried out in the name of the classless society, he does not reject the ideal of a classless society. Indeed, King describes the classless society as a "noble end" (STRENGHT TO LOVE, p. 168)--even though Marxists Leninists seek it by ignoble means. But that classless society, free of economic and political oppression--free also of racism--is the ultimate aim of socialism or communism. (And we may recall that in HOMAGE TO CATALONIA, Orwell claims that for the average socialist worker in Spain during the 1930s, socialism meant a classless society---for King, a "noble end"). Indeed, isn't that also what Nkrumah wanted (at least initially)? isn't that what Fanon wanted? A liberated human being in a liberated society achieved by means of socialism and democracy? So, did King. So do I.
-Savant
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If you've not even HEARD of Antonio Gramsci and Georg Lukacs, they you really need to improve your education. Lukacs most famous work is probably HISTORY AND CLASS CONSCIOUSNESS--whi ch I read as a STUDENT. Antonio Gramsci is known for his PRISON NOTEBOOKS, one edition of which I also read while a student. Those two are perhaps the most famous Marxist philosophers of the 20th century! Not only philosophers, but historians, sociologists, political scientists and even many psychologists (like humanist Marxist Erich Fromm) would be deeply familiar with them. I've READ their works as well as scholarly studies of them. While I can claim to have read ALL of their voluminous works, I've read a considerable of it. Again, I don't recall reading any statement by either of them saying "I am a Marxist." But in ANY scholarly community of philosophers or social scientists you'd be thought a dunce if you didn't know that Gramsci and Lukacs were Marxists!
-Savant
_________________________
Of course, if you've read Nkrumah you know that he was a socialist of a decidedly Marxist as well as Pan-Africanist orientation. And if you're politically and historically informed, you're aware that socialism derives from Left traditions of politics and thought just as Fascism derives from Right wing traditions. Nkrumah, Cabral, Mondlane, Fanon and other were all socialists and explicitly anti-right wing, anti-capitalist. We ought to remember as well that after Stokely popularized "Black Power" in 1966, there soon developed some debate over what it actually meant. Some more conservative nationalists (coinciding with Richard Nixon) identified Black Power as 'black capitalism"--and eventually began saying everything was really about "green power". Some engage in mystical fabrications by identifying Black power with the obscurantist politics of cultural nationalism. For awhile Imamu Baraka and Ron karenga was running that line. Other interpreted Black Power in term of radical empowerment of the masses of our people, an empowerment that meant the revolutionary transcendence of imperialism, capitalism and racism. Stokely leaned in that direction. So, too, did the Black Panther party for awhile. And various other lesser known. A revolutionary analysis and interpretation of the Black Powr Movement can be found in Robert Allen's BLACK AWAKENING IN CAPITALIST AMERICA. An "insightful" but not revolutionary analysis is also offered by Black nationalist scholar Harold Cruse in THE CRISIS OF THE NEGRO INTELLECTAL. And Dr. King--since his legacy is supposed to be the THEME of this thread--works out his own coming to terms with Black Power in WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE, CHAOS OR COMMUNITY. I think we can learn more of value from these brothers who were there than from ranting buffoons like Assdurratin.
-Savant
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One thing is interesting: On more than one occasion King clearly states his OPPOSITION to both capitalism and Communism ( least in Marxist Leninist version). He NEVER says he's against socialism, and he points to both Scandinavian and East Indian socialist tendencies with OBVIOUS approval. I mentioned to Ekdesiladki, and Indian lady who used to post here, about some of the leaders of agrarian reform movements in India whom King met there after the Montgomery campaign,. They were promoting agricultural cooperatives to redistribute wealth and empower the Indian poor. Ekdesi informed me that these leaders were Gandhian socialists who tried to continue the legacy of Gandhi (the spiritual aims of the movement) after the Mahatma's assassination. When she mentioned that they were Gandhian socialists---which didn't exactly take me by surprise since King was esteeming their promotion of Indian cooperatives---I simply said to Desi: "I should have known it! A Christian socialist admiring a Gandhian Hindu socialist." King is always on he side of the disinherited and the dispossessed.
-Savant
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